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From: B. Harris)
Subject: Re: Lisa Mcpherson's Final Days
Date: 20 Jul 1997
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology,,,

In <> (Ex Mudder)

>  I counted 3 glasses of water in 17 days.  Everything else was
>Clamag, bananas, various vitamins, shitloads of electrolytes (inection
>or capsule, not gatorade), some sedatives, OJ, and protein shakes.
>  Talk about fucking up your electrolyte balance - K, Mg, Ca are all +
>ions. No - ions to balance them out (like Cl).

   I've got news for you: any element given as a positive ion has just
as many negative ions in there balancing it out.  This is because
solutions are NOT charged.  If they were, you'd see electrostatic
effects-- something that would make your hair stand on end, and zap you
with static electricity bolts.

>  Probably made her
>blood highly acidic as well.  Plus, no water to buffer it.
>  Same with the Protein shakes.  You need a lot of water to deal with
>that much protein.  No carbos either.  Its like coffee - one cup of
>coffee needs one cup of water to flush it out.  Many of these were
>similar - they need to be taken with a lot of water.

   There is a lot of hidden water in any kind of shake.  If you want to
see if the person is dehydrated, you need merely look at the creatinine
values in the blood.  People who die of dehydration go into renal
failure first.  They also have abnormally high serum sodium levels.
High BUN values can be an early sign of dehydration, or they can simply
be the result of a high protein intake.  BUN (blood urea nitrogen) is a
measure of blood urea-- protein which has already been sucessfully
broken down.

                                        Steve Harris, M.D.

From: B. Harris)
Subject: Re: Lisa Mcpherson's Final Days
Date: 23 Jul 1997
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology,

In <5r3ked$esd$1@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM> wbarwell@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM
(William Barwell) writes:

>If Lisa was being fed high protein stuff, but taking little water, the
>urea would build up as there was no way to excrete it without intake of
>water. You cannot urinate without water intake, so urea can't be flushed
>out of the system efficiently.
>Pope Charles
>SubGenius Pope Of Houston

In dehydration, typically blood urea is quite elevated.  As dehydration
continues into renal failure, blood creatinine goes up also.  Lisa
McPherson's BUN and creatinine were both elevated.  Most important, her
sodium levels were sky high, indicating (along with the other numbers)
a severe shortage of "free water," or water without salts.  Her labs
look like those you see in Cuban refugees who've been out in a boat
without water on the ocean for days before being hauled into Florida.

                                      Steve Harris, M.D.

From: "Howard McCollister" <>
Subject: Re: Laparoscopic Surgeryy
Date: 26 Jan 2005 15:13:18 -0600
Message-ID: <41f7d6aa$0$57363$>

<> wrote in message
> wrote:
>> Hi,
>> Could some one tell me how during laparoscopic removal of gall bladders
>> are the excretory functions (urine&fecal matter) arrested or dealt
>> with?
>> Many thanks,
>> Helen
> I had mine removed a year ago.  No problem in the suregery
> but....instructions were not to drink fluids after 8PM.  Surgery was
> 11am.  Was told by the scheduling nurse in the Dr's office that at best
> he could even be earlier at worst "a little late".  They were trying to
> fill that spot!  Figured not that much of a difficulty.  Well Murphy's
> Gods came calling Dr. was delayed until 3PM.  No water for 19 hours!
> That nite was hell frankly.  They wouldn't let me go until I voided x
> amount of fluid.  I had none, and they actually spoke of some type of
> previously unknown system problem.  Hell, 19 hours, I was dehydrated.
> I was told that if I didn,t void I would be caterhized (my idea of
> hell)  and could not go home until I did!.  I stood numb from pain
> killers, swaying in the wind trying to meet thier quota in the wee
> morning hours!  I did go home next day!  Please don't misunderstand the
> surgery itself was remarkable and went fine with no problems afterward,
> but make sure you are HYDRATED.... if unsure talk to the MD

Normally, in any kind of competent surgical unit, you would have an IV
started shortly after arriving. You wouldn't be able to drink or eat
anything since they would want your stomach empty for the anesthesia, but it
would be unconsionable if they weren't running fluid into you while you were
waiting all that time. Furthermore, any competent anesthetist would make
sure that you were not dehydrated prior to induction of anesthesia, and in
ANY case it is an absolutely fundamental tenet of anesthesia that the
patient come off the table euvolemic.

There is a difference between being dehydrated and being unable to void.
Frequently, the anesthetic drugs will have an anticholinergic effect, and
that's especially true if atropine or similar drugs were used (as they often
are). Urinary retention is a common side effect. It's not related to
dehydration in any way.

If your difficulty voiding before going home was truly due to dehydration,
then that particular surgical unit is staffed by incompetent boobs. YOUR
medical condition may have been sufficient to tolerate anesthesia in such a
dehydrated state, but it's the kind of thing that KILLS older people with
compromised cardiovascular systems. These are such fundamental
standard-of-care issues that it's far more likely you were just unable to
urinate as a drug side effect rather than being dehydrated.


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