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From: (Jobst Brandt)
Subject: Re: Mysterious Wheel Noise
Date: 14 Apr 1998 20:05:05 GMT

Andrew Wilks writes:

> My rear wheel is a Mavic Open Pro laced to a Dura Ace hub.  3x 15g
> drive and 15/16g left.  I get a strange scrunching noise on every
> revolution that appears to be coming from the rim or spokes. If I
> hadn't tried several tires, I'd think it was gum or tar on the tire,
> but it's not.

I'm not sure what the sound is, such sounds being difficult to
describe.  However, a common source of cyclic creaking sounds is rust
in the spoke nipple to rim socket interface.  Rust has an amazingly
crunchy sound that appears as sharp cracking sounds in a wheel ball
bearing and as a clicking creaking sound in rims.  Although oiling
between the nipples and rim socket can temporarily suppress the noise,
it will probably return as soon as the spot gets wet again, since
water easily displaces oil.

Jobst Brandt      <>

From: (Jobst Brandt)
Subject: Re: Well used rim "clicking"
Date: 6 May 1999 16:39:31 GMT

Chuck Anderson writes:

> Over the last few months I've noticed a "click" every time the front
> wheels goes around.  I repacked the bearings and checked all kinds of
> things, but to no avail.

This is typical of rust.  If the steel eyelets are rusty, as they
easily can be after nipple motion has removed the protective plating,
they will click.  This can be temporarily be fixed by a drop of oil on
the interface but it will probably continue to click after any wet
riding.  This is also a clear indication that this joint frets and is
not a static junction.  This is why aluminum nipples sometimes break.

Jobst Brandt      <>

From: (Jobst Brandt)
Subject: Re: Mavic Open Pro Question
Date: 7 Apr 2001 03:41:55 GMT

Michael Conway writes:

>>> Thought that I would take the opportunity of another thread on
>>> these wheels to thank everyone for their suggestions on getting
>>> rid of the noise in mine.

>>> The suggestion to oil the spokes seems to have been right on
>>> target.  Since doing this I have ridden through a range of
>>> conditions (wet and dry, hot and cold, good roads and bad) and
>>> have yet to hear the noise.

>> If that solved the problem, you should be aware that most clicking
>> sounds are caused by iron oxide (rust) on the eyelets and that this
>> will come back as lubrication fails.

> So is there an alternative solution?  Apart from the annoying noise
> the wheel is as solid as the day I first rode it ( a few years and
> many, many miles ago).

There isn't one unless you want to unspoke the wheel, steel wool the
seats and paint them with slow drying paint inside so that you can
build the wheel and have it seal afterwards.  I don't see this as a
solution though and have lived with clicking rims until they wore out
from winter braking.

> Am I correct in guessing that the amount of rust we are talking
> about here is not going to be a threat to the integrity of the
> wheel?

It's mostly insignificant.  Not to worry.

>> When water gets into wheel bearings, the clicking is louder and
>> random as granules of rust get between bearing balls and races.

> That sounds nasty and far more terminal.

Not really.  You just clean up the cups and cones with a rag and toss
in new balls.  I've done it often after high speed descents in the
mountains where the wheel bearings sometimes get soaked.

Jobst Brandt      <>

Subject: Re: Wheel noise
Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2001 01:48:15 GMT

Glenn Ammons writes:

>> I'm curious whether any of these wheels have stainless steel eyelets or
>> sockets.  Making these of stainless steel is not for beauty but rather
>> to prevent this from occurring.


> The Torelli webpage you linked says: All eyeletted rims use
> stainless steel eyelets.

That's why I posted it.  As I said. there is no good reason for
stainless eyelets except to prevent this occurrence.  My MA-2 rims do
not have stainless hardware and I have on occasion experienced the
clicking.  That is where I discovered the symptom.  Aluminum clicking
is more common in handlebars but because I don't use aluminum spoke
nipples, I can only guess that they could be the cause.

Jobst Brandt    <>

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